Comments on Just Plain Sense: Thank you, but...

Great job, thanks!

2011-07-03T11:30:20.692+01:00

Great job, thanks!

Although not bidding for the national / internatio...

2011-07-02T18:08:00.993+01:00

Although not bidding for the national / international resource spot I thought you'd like to know that your suggestions @Cheryl have prompted me to assemble all the podcast shows on trans topics in one place.

I give you .... The Trans Tapes

Hi Christine: Absolutely with you on the non-hier...

2011-07-02T17:36:22.814+01:00

Hi Christine:

Absolutely with you on the non-hierarchical, and absolutely with you on the need for wider publicity as well.

There was some talk on Twitter of a plan for a trans lifestyle magazine along similar lines to Diva. That would be a great place to do interviews, and advertise podcasts. But of course such things need someone to invest, and lots of hard work to make the commercially viable, which as I am finding out is very hard right now.

I'd like to think someone could create a national, or even international, media resource for trans people. Then I read the latest round of posts about terminology wars and weep in despair.

Hi @Cheryl, I agree with you on the point about s...

2011-07-02T15:20:06.630+01:00

Hi @Cheryl,

I agree with you on the point about showcasing role models to a degree, although arguably that is better done in a non-hierarchic fashion via other kinds of site .. a bit like Lynn Conway's Trans Successes pages, but without her tendency to have privileged looks and passing.

As for the Podcasts, my intention when I began the Press for Change Podcasts back in 2005 was to enable real trans people to be heard discussing real trans subjects, in a way that we were never at that time hearing in the mainstream media. It mirrored my motivations in beginning to write about issues so extensively more than a decade before.

Now we have several very visible trans people writing in the mainstream media, so that is beginning to change, as discussed here by Juliet Jacques. However, film, radio and TV have more catching up to do, so I agree on the desirability of more podcast audio and video material presenting trans people talking and doing things just as anyone else would be featured.

Having said that we have to be realistic about the role model value though. Bearing in mind that blogs and podcasts are global media, the audience figures are disappointing.

The most popular of my Just Plain Sense Podcasts, with well known names, tend to have topped out at around 1100-1200 downloads, which suggests there are barriers, or maybe newcomers aren't making the connection.

Some of that is because only a handful of people help to publicise that they're there. However, I also suspect that the 'role model' value only really kicks in when young trans people are seeing those people on the mainstream media. Being featured by me on a small niche platform doesn't cut it in terms of the message you're looking for.

However, if any people want to help ensure those kinds of interviews are getting heard more then I can certainly facilitate making that easy to do by consolidating all the trans podcasts in a single blog.

Hi Christine, Many thanks for the mention, and my...

2011-07-01T22:04:33.235+01:00

Hi Christine,

Many thanks for the mention, and my sympathy regarding the unfortunate side-effects of winning awards. I've seen that in a very small way. I can see that it must be so much worse if you get an MBE.

As regards such lists, it occurs to me that the primary reason that newspapers publish them is to generate controversy over who is/isn't included. If they can manage to ignore a vociferous minority, so much the better. We shouldn't be surprised this happens.

Also we live in a class- and celebrity-obsessed society. Who is "in" and who isn't appears to grip the public imagination like nothing else. So yes, people with an axe to grid will seek to "disappear" groups they don't approve of.

The question I'm asking myself is, can these lists actually benefit us, and if not what might do better?

It seems to me that the primary advantage of such a list for the trans community is to provide role models, to reassure people contemplating transition that it won't destroy their lives. It is great for people to be able to follow Juliet's journey through the process in The Guardian, and to see young people like Paris and CN getting famous, but equally I think they need to hear from those of us who are many years post-transition and who still have jobs, friends, family and fulfilling lives. Appearance in a celebrity list gives a hint of that, but only a hint.

The podcast interviews that you have done are a great example of the sort of thing I think we need. Ethan St.Pierre does a great job over in the US as well. I'd like to see more of that sort of thing, and ideally it getting wider publicity so that the general public can also see trans people having successful lives. That might help dispel the "tragic trans person" myth.

...just to clarify why these people should be incl...

2011-07-01T08:33:52.204+01:00

...just to clarify why these people should be included - a description to accompany their name (apologies if incorrect). More information about these people can be found by "Google-ing" their names (probably)

Paige Reeves (Trans Suicide Watch)
Ash Surrey (Singer)
Martha TGO (Trans London)
M A Tovey (Musician)
Linda Harper (Chair N.T.P.A.)
Random Dent (Musician)

Valentino Vecchietti (chair FtM London, technical ...

2011-06-30T22:15:42.314+01:00

Valentino Vecchietti (chair FtM London, technical advisor for Hollyoaks FtM character and much else)

Paige Reeves Martha TGO

2011-06-30T20:17:51.542+01:00

Paige Reeves
Martha TGO

three more Pietà Schofield (Transtay) Denise Ande...

2011-06-30T20:09:05.238+01:00

three more

Pietà Schofield (Transtay)
Denise Anderson (Spectrum London etc)
Nic Douglas

2011-06-30T20:07:17.944+01:00

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Thanks Paul. I didn't consider for a moment th...

2011-06-28T16:13:28.633+01:00

Thanks Paul. I didn't consider for a moment that you were "making mischief" in drawing my attention to the Time Out list. And, to give them credit, I have discovered subsequently the the creators did try to tweet those featured with a link to the list, although for some reason the tweet to me didn't appear in my feed (I've no idea why).

You raise an interesting question. A list just for trans people? That wasn't something I was trying to do in listing people above ... and I suspect people might look on that as an approach which would divert from the main problem...

Time Out's list purports to be an LGBT list. Therefore the issue at hand is whether T (and B) are adequately represented in that field. If it was suggested, for instance, that there should be a separate Lesbian list then I suspect there would be uproar.

So, I think it is important that a discussion should not distract people away from that issue.

Whether or not someone would want to produce a separarate (complementary) list of notable trans people every year should remain a separate question, which the trans community might want to consider once the fundamental question of wider community inclusion and balance has been addressed.

I'm happy that I played my role in all this an...

2011-06-28T08:49:40.767+01:00

I'm happy that I played my role in all this and reflect on the way that many who are alert to the lack of balance are often also overlooked. The individuals who place information in the hands of people like yourself, Christine, do so to help the recognition of the invisibility of many by calling attention to the few. You have, as ever, written so well and so cogently in a way that makes me feel pleased to have been of help.

It also makes me wonder if there is a need or use for the kind of list you have generated being given some prestige and notoriety? An 'Oscar' or 'Bafta' or '?' I can hear the roar of complaints already!

While I might be accused of making mischief, I am trying to suggest that having one's own list would work to benefit the overall community, providing a resource full of inspiration and encouragement. As to what to call it...well my suggestion would be...

;-)

Thanks for compiling this list, the names I'd ...

2011-06-28T00:47:58.704+01:00

Thanks for compiling this list, the names I'd suggest are already included.

I'm very glad to see the names of visible non-binary/genderqueer people on the full list. I hope that in a year from now the work that Practical Androgyny and Think Outside The Box have planned will have added a few more.

from Martha Dunkley, this is such a brilliant lis...

2011-06-27T23:25:17.257+01:00

from Martha Dunkley,

this is such a brilliant list and well done Christine for compiling it (and adding Harri Cole Weeks).

May I suggest some more lovely people who work so hard almost all voluntary and with no thought of public notice:

Michelle Ross (Terence Higgins Trust)
Joe Swift (FtM London and UKLGIG)
Michelle Bridgeman (Gender Trust AKA Trans standup Shelley Cooper)
Valentino ~lastName~ (FtM London)
Persia West (A Place at the Table)
Sue Louise (FtM London SOFFAs)

(will send Valentino's last name when he replied to my msg)

(Reposted to remove a name from the list by reques...

2011-06-27T22:32:05.322+01:00

(Reposted to remove a name from the list by request)

I couldn't agree with you more about the trans men Harri, and I'm sorry if (in subbing down a longer list) I carelessly lost the gender balance that I was originally aiming for.

I've pasted the whole list of names that people suggested below. The reason why I didn't refer to them all in the article was because I realised that I couldn't do justice to describing them all. There was therefore a risk of me doing exactly the same as I am 'chastising' Time Out for.

What would be really interesting would be if people could use the comments below to expand on the reasons why these people are notable (or up and coming talents to watch). Any other omissions are down to my own inability to keep up in a rapidly burgeoning field of more and more fabulous people.

Anyway, here's the full list of the names people put forward:

Christina Alley
Louis Bailey
Jason Elvis Barker
Bethany Black
Sarah Brown
Harri Cole
Zoe O'Connell
Kate Craig-Wood
Random Dent
Paula Dooley
Alex Drummond
Christie Elan-Kane
Jane Fae
Lee Gale
Ben Gooch
Linda Harper
Tessa Hawke
Juliet Jacques
Roz Kaveney
Natacha Kennedy
Jennie Kermode
Sarah Lake
Paris Lees
CN Lester
Jay McNeil
Cheryl Morgan
James Morton
Serge Nicholson
Ruth Pearce
Emma Roebuck
Jay Stewart
Ash Surrey
Melissa Symes
MA Tovey

I'll reply properly to explain why people are ...

2011-06-27T18:52:16.992+01:00

I'll reply properly to explain why people are awesome soon or tomorrow, but just a quick heads-up:
My name's Harri Weeks, Cole is my middle name, which I tend to include most of the time, but harri_cole is just my handle on twitter etc...

Hi Christine, I think this a really great post, I ...

2011-06-27T16:14:13.489+01:00

Hi Christine,
I think this a really great post, I hope the compilers of these lists see it and it makes them think.
However, I'm sure I'm not the only one who's a little disappointed that almost 85% of your list is transwomen.
Of course you can't please everyone, and all those listed do very much deserve it, but there are many other trans people doing both public and behind-the-scenes work which is worth highlighting. The lack of visability or recognition afforded to trans men (and to an even greater extent, trans people who do not fit the binary) has, in the opinion of many people I know, the effect of making active involvement in the work of the community harder, as it seems focussed on a different set of issues, and because like attracts like.
I wouldn't presume to think I could create an exhaustive list of influential transmen, and would have to defer to outhers as to whether I should be included, but I was very surprised by the ommission of Jason Barker, Serge Nicholson, Jay Stewart, Fionn Greig, Ben Gooch, Lee Gale and Jay McNeil, for a start.

I'm waiting for the rush of "How could yo...

2011-06-27T12:37:06.230+01:00

I'm waiting for the rush of "How could you possibly not include so-and-so!" comments!

(Oh, and Juliet Jacques was long-listed for the Orwell Prize. Being merely "nominated" isn't much of an accolade given it's self-nomination!)

You definitely deserved to be on that list for leg...

2011-06-26T15:58:19.517+01:00

You definitely deserved to be on that list for legitimate reasons, but it sucks that it was done in such a 'tokenising' fashion. Either Jan Morris or Roz Kaveney should've been on the list with you.